I’m about halfway through Lynn Packer’s book, Lying for the Lord. Packer is nephewfor former apostle Boyd K. Packer. I didn’t know that Paul Dunn and Boyd Packer had a little bit of a CES rivalry going on. Both came up at the same time in the LDS Seminary program. Paul got a theology degree from Chapman College in California and was trained in classic biblical criticism. Boyd was a protege of J. Reuben Clark, who weeded out LDS Seminary teachers who didn’t teach faith promoting stories from the bible (and who taught evolution as real.) I was a little familiar with this story, as I talked about the Chicago Experiment. Paul believed that Boyd had sent his nephew Lynn to search out his unflattering reports on Paul’s untrue war and baseball stories. However, Lynn says that is completely untrue.
Lynn was a reporter for KSL Television and adjunct faculty member at BYU in 1982. Some people came to him in 1979, concerned that they had invested in a real estate company that Paul Dunn had promoted that seemed to be faltering. Lynn investigated the company for KSL news and come to learn it was fraudelent. In 1979, Lynn asked Paul about the company AFCO, since Paul was on the board of directors and featured prominently in advertising for the company. Paul defended the owners and told Lynn not to run the story. He put pressure on Lynn’s boss, Spence Kinard to kill the story. Kinard complied though Lynn didn’t know all the details until much later during the trial of AFCO. During questioning of Grant Affleck, one of the owners of AFCO (for whom the company was named), page 214:
Question: Did Elder Dunn, to your knowledge, ever call the news media?
Answer: He did.
Question: What was the purpose of those calls?
Answer: After I returned from Japan and after we found that there was a party going after our lenders and causing particular problems, that a news story would not break at that time…Elder Dunn did call the news station.
Judge David K. Winder asked Affleck, “Just what was the purpose?”
“The of the call was to have them discontinue any further interruptions with our company to close the loan,” Affleck said.
But that’s not all. Apparently Dunn, after he talked to Packer in 1979, faked a letter of resignation in 1978 to avoid problems with the trial. Affleck was asked again about this fake resignation letter. Lynn writes on page 213,
Affleck’s answers were what I needed to complete my story about Dunn’s lying about his resignation.
Question: What relationship did Paull H. Dunn have to do with AFCO?
Answer: He served as a board of director to the company and, at the end, right up through March 1st of 1982, was an advisor director.
It was bombshell testimony. Carruth continued.
Question: Did you at some point sign a letter that was given to the President (of the LDS Church) that said that Paul H. Dunn was not involved in the latter part of AFCO?
Answer: I did.
Question: Why did you do that?
Answer: I would have done anything to not have his exposure at that time.
Question: What does that mean, his exposure?
Answer: I didn’t think it was appropriate to have Elder Dunn drawn into this thing.
Prosecutors did not go after Dunn at the time because of his celebrity status. They wanted the trial to be about Affleck, not Dunn and were worried that calling Dunn to the stand would take the focus off Affleck. Defense attorneys were asked by Affleck to avoid calling Dunn. So Dunn skated off without charges.
AFCO was really a ponzi scheme, in which new investors paid off old investors. As part of his role on the board of directors, Dunn got a new car, often a Mercedes-Benz or other expensive model, every 6 months without paying a dime. Of course Dunn got his original investment back, a kind of hush money. From page 209
[Dunn] has made false statements and provided false documents to his higher church leaders, to the press, and to two sets of attorneys taking his depositions and provided false documents to his depositions.
Prosecutors were more concerned about Affeck and partner, who were sentenced to 10 years in prison. It was while Lynn Packer was trying to get an interview with Affleck, that an intermediary told Lynn that Dunn’s war and baseball stories weren’t true either.
Dunn claimed both to have been drafted at age 18 and signed a pro contract with the St. Louis Cardinals. Both could not be true. In reality, neither were true. When Paul was 18, the draft age was 21, but congress did lower the age soon, and Dunn was drafted at age 19, serving in the army at age 20. Despite saying he had pitched to greats like Babe Ruth, Lou Gehrig, Willie Mays, Ted Williams, and Joe DiMaggio, Paul Dunn only played professional baseball in the minor leagues for 1 week before being released. There are several levels of baseball: AAA is just under the major leagues, then AA, A, B, and C. Dunn didn’t last longer than a week for the lowest league.
He never actually served a combat role, as evidence by those who served with him. He told a story of being stuck in a shallow fox hole, and a Japanese tank running over and crushing American soldiers. Somehow the tank pinned Paul to the ground, where Paul was stuck by his helmet. The tank miraculously reversed, saving Paul’s life.
It never happened.
Paul talked about wading through water with dead men floating around him. He talked of killing Japs. He talked about holding his best friend, Harold Brown, as Harold died. Yet Lynn Packer talked to Harold Brown, who was very much alive.
Paul produced letters to “prove” his stories. Many of the letters were fake, and didn’t support his stories either. It seems Paul Dunn was a forger like Mark Hoffman.
It’s been a pretty good read so far. What do you make of Paul Dunn’s legacy?
Wheat & Tares 
Traumatic. The narcissism this type of crap bred into Mormon culture still lingers and has contributed to if not created the toxic environment some are trying to clean up. This man (and many others) were sick in the head and men who put him on a pedestal were sick as well and they haven’t died yet and they still prlerpetuate a mentality of infallibility which is beyond annoying and Mormons just really need to get over themselves.
The title of the book is odd. Dunn’s lies were entirely in his own self-interest rather than to protect the Church as the original “liars for the Lord” claimed during the Smoot hearings. Did Dunn ever claim divine sanction of his lies?
I half-way argree with LL. It doesn’t matter to me in the least whether he “claimed revelation” or not, since he holds authority either way. (It’s strange how so many people think that claiming revelation matters when they want to disagree – but that it doesn’t matter when they’re sure that others already disagree.) What matters to me is that these all seem aimed at forwarding his own interests and if D&C 121 ever came into play, this is it!
And look at who brought him down.
Last Lemming, I think it’s mainly a play on words. Yes Dunn’s lies were in his own self-interest. But when caught by the Arizona Republic concerning the war and baseball stories, he said his lies were “to teach principles.” The motivation was different than the polygamist liars, but he was still lying in his testimony and talks, and was doing it for the Lord.
Did he give divine sanction to his lies? Probably not. But he did lay his hands on Grant Affleck (and the other owner), giving them divine sanction to bilk “investors” in their fraud. That was pretty awful. Many people lost homes because Dunn misused his position of authority to lull them into a false sense of security.
Thankfully, once the Church heard of the problems, it took the appropriate action to release Elder Dunn from his general authority responsibilities. Any lies Elder Dunn told were for himself, not for the Lord (as suggested by the title).
If a non-GA member had done this, no doubt a disciplinary council would have been convened. That probably didn’t happen to save face for the Church.
I personally know tremendous pressure was put on Lynn Packer by both church and community figures not to break the story of Dunn’s tale-telling.
When will we learn that sunlight is the best disinfectant?
Mormon Heretic: Was one of the stories about a bullet being stopping at a particular scripture?
What do I make of Dunn’s legacy? I think he’s just one example of the many leaders we have who, for whatever reason, think that either hiding or bending the truth in the name of some greater good is okay. Many of them believe that they’re serving the Lord with their half-truths because they’re covering over the sins of the church. Ironically, they’re bending the truth for the purpose of shielding an imperfect institution, something the Lord himself would never sanction. It’s astonishing that we’d produce these kinds of leaders, especially if one believes the Lord really is in charge of this church.
“October 23, 1991
“I have been accused of various activities unbecoming a member of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints.
“I confess that I have not always been accurate in my public talks and writings. Furthermore, I have indulged in other activities inconsistent with the high and sacred office which I have held.
“For all of these I feel a deep sense of remorse, and ask forgiveness of any whom I may have offended.
“My brethren of the General Authorities, over a long period of time, have conducted in-depth investigations of the charges made against me. They have weighed the evidence. They have censured me and placed a heavy penalty upon me.
“I accept their censure and the imposed penalty, and pledge to conduct my life in such a way as to merit their confidence and full fellowship.
“In making these acknowledgements, I plead for the understanding of my brethren and sisters throughout the Church and give assurance of my determination so to live as to bring added respect to the cause I deeply love, and honor to the Lord who is my Redeemer.
“Sincerely, Paul H. Dunn”
Oct. 26, 1991, in the Church News, two years after he was released as an active member of the Seventy. He died in 1998.
Paul Dunn is gone now but shall we conclude that embellishments no longer go on? That Monson’s cute little stories are all completely factual?
It seems to me that lying “to teach principles” and lying for the Lord are time honored LDS methods taken with a wink and a nod when offered by General Authorities or apologists and that lack of integrity trickles right on down to our Stakes, Wards and homes mimicked and perpetuated by otherwise well intended faithful members.
Morgan, I haven’t come across that story yet, but it sounds like something he might say.
Lynn Packer wasn’t Pres. Packer’s brother, he is his nephew. I knew two men who served under Pres. Dunn in the New England Mission and both said independantly of each other that Pres. Dunn knew he was telling fables as a joke about his war experience and he thought that after his mission he’d forget about it but the stories were going around and so he had to keep it up. That may explain why he was never exed, as he knew and the missionaries knew they weren’t real. I think most people have forgotten about him or never heard of him TBH
Howard, what do you care what the church leaders do? Seems like you’ve dedicated way too much of your life to undermining them.
I didn’t learn of Dunn’s AFCO activities until I heard of this book. I thougth that he was just a guy who used made-up stories. But being involved in a ponzi scheme and using his status in church for that is much worse. If it had been my decision, I would have excommunicate him.
Where there’s smoke there’s fire. He was just one of many who got caught, one of many the cronies just couldn’t protect.
What’s funny is Dunns faith promoting falsehoods really supported The Packers Philosophy.
Hearkening back to a more volatile post from last week, this is why we need our leaders to present revelation rather than platitudes.
Yes Jeff G, I would love to see revelation return to the church, it’s been missing or nearly so for a long time.
A complexity in this matter was briefly mentioned at the top: Paul H. Dunn was, for a general authority, a fairly anti-establishment figure, a lot closer to being another Sterling McMurrin than another Boyd K. Packer. I was present once when Elder Dunn spoke in Artemus Ham Hall on the UNLV campus. The president of UNLV, Robert Maxon, was there and made some introductory remarks with his mild Texas twang before turning the mike over to “Dr. Dunn.” Maxon found it easy to think of Dunn in the same terms he would apply to any Christian minister that came on his campus.
Greg Prince seems to be a fan of Paul H. Dunn, and the two links below give some detail of the expansive, inclusive qualities Prince valued in Dunn.
Prince on Dunn:
bycommonconsent.com/2009/10/07/jeanne-cheverton-dunn/
rationalfaiths.com/celebrating-differences/
That is interesting John
As is often the case, I line up with Brother Sky. His comment of
“I think he’s just one example of the many leaders we have who, for whatever reason, think that either hiding or bending the truth in the name of some greater good is okay.”
To me this shows a lack of faith in the church’s narrative if someone has to hide a whole bunch to keep “the faithful from falling”. I think about Acts 5:38&39
And now I say unto you, Refrain from these men, and let them alone: for if this counsel or this work be of men, it will come to nought:
But if it be of God, ye cannot overthrow it; lest haply ye be found even to fight against God.
God does not need “help” by embellishing something or cover-ups. If you have faith that God is in control, then you know his team is going to win without cheating. If you don’t have that faith, it seems to me that is when people feel they need to “lie for the Lord”.
I meet PHD while on my mission. Me and my companion meet him in his hotel room to bring him something as a favor. We talked for a while. He seemed very nice and pleasant, but I did get the feeling of, “I know you two young elders are really pleased to be able to meet me face to face.”
I never understood what troll meant and then I ran into Howard
a person who sows discord on the Internet by starting arguments or upsetting people, by posting inflammatory, extraneous, or off-topic messages in an online community
Ronkonkoma,
It feels to me like you are doing an ad-hominoid attack (attacking the person/person’s character instead of refuting the question). Maybe respond with what is wrong with his question instead of just labeling him a “troll”.
Sure he often presents a rather critical/cynical slant in his comments, but it is often best if we take questions at face value and look to see if there is any validity to the question.
Matthew 7:3-5 (before you help pull out the mote in someone else’s eye, check your own first) applies to both Howard and you – and myself also.
On #12 Howard asks a reasonable question – “was PHD the only one that had this issue?” and “do we have people doing it currently?”
If you have an issue with him on #19 insinuating that there is no more revelation, just go look at http://www.wheatandtares.org/21749/are-we-really-a-church-of-revelation/ and the nearly 100 comments says he is not alone.
Howard,
“Yes Jeff G, I would love to see revelation return to the church, it’s been missing or nearly so for a long time.”
And you think generalizing criticisms and accusations as far as possible within an online forum (like you do in 12, above) is that best way to accomplish that?
Folks, this man’s legacy is more than tangled for me. Maybe when my generation does out, then Elder Dunn will just be an interesting albeit obscure footnote.
But forty-five years ago, he toured the European missions and spent entire day’s visiting with zones of missionaries. Even now, I consider it a remarkable experience that I remember vividly. He pushed us away from traditional Mormon folklore and tried to get us to think past the scripts we had learned instead to concentrate on authentic doctrine. (No, we didn’t talk WW2.) Many of us had what was as close to a Day of Pentecost sensation that we might have ever had in our lives.
I had long left the borders of conventional Mormonism when the “scandal” broke; the middle column, front page WSJ article, etc. Yet I was incredibly saddened. And saddened again as I view this renewed highlighting of his fabrications and misrepresentations. Maybe it’s just an overall nostalgia for a time of belief, trust and comfort. I just know it is sad.
The interesting thing to me in all this is how many of us said we felt the Spirit when Dunn spoke. He was a favorite with missionaries and members alike. I cannot tell you how many people said they felt the Spirit and were so inspired by his talks.What does this say about the Spirit as a precise measure of truth?
I think more it asks the question about what God can do with even greatly flawed men.
Con men, by definition, pull off what they do because they are charismatic, likable, and inspirational. That’s how a confidence trick works. In our family, the con man got away with what he did because people loved him and he was a bishop. People couldn’t believe the Spirit would ever allow a bad egg to be a bishop.
Jeff G,
We’ll it calls attention to the fact that the church falls far short of actually being lead by God which suggests that it would be better if it were, which in turn is an invitation for the brethern to engage God.
From #27 “What does this say about the Spirit as a precise measure of truth?”
and then #28: “I think more it asks the question about what God can do with even greatly flawed men.”
If I may offer a trollish comment. Both those comments presume the “Spirit.” I have long believed that nearly all of what we/others feel at such moments is emotion, not “the Spirit.” That would explain, better, why self-serving, rhetoric, and hyperbole are so effective in the context where we are being emotionally affected, not spiritually “fed.”
While the effect on us, in such circumstances, is usually for the good. That is not the same thing as an actual presence and endorsement by “the Spirit.” The conundrum is that much good (and life-changing motivation) comes from such (false) feelings.
Paul H. Dunn had a cult-like following. Years ago, he was a known commodity. Everyone knew that he could bring in the crowds and entertain them. He was an entertainer masked as a religious expert and leader.
He was quoted. He was revered.
When we all found out that his stories were all false, I remember feeling betrayed. I had heard him speak. He stood up for an hour and told story after story. Each story was explicit and detailed. Every detail was a lie.
Currently, it is amazing to see the books, music, and kitsch that get marketed in the name of a church that preaches the importance of staying away from a market-based focus.
This gives me something to ponderize.
Elder Oaks tells why Mormons fall for get rich quick schemes: http://www.ldsliving.com/Elder-Oaks-Tackles-Why-Mormons-Have-Such-a-Problem-with-Get-Rich-Quick-Schemes/s/82898
I met Elder Paul H Dunn once, it was while serving a mission in Okinawa. He was a wonderful person, generous and reasonable and not proud or aloof. He was to speak to the military servicemen and then the local native members got wind of it and also wanted to come and hear him. I had a native companion. The idea was that Elder Dunn would speak a sentence, I would translate it into missionary Japanese and my companion would translate it into proper Japanese. We practiced a bit before and it was going to not be without serious problems.
Then our native Japanese mission president showed up unexpectedly. For once I was greatly relieved. He understood English well and spoke fluent Japanese. He also had sense of humor. When Elder Dunn’s jokes didn’t translate, the mission president added in Japanese, “please laugh” which was hilarious and everyone laughed. Many terms describing baseball are not changed very much in Japanese (strike 3 = suturaiki 3) and the native members would laugh before the translation. It also misfired a couple of times in other ways. Elder Dunn realized that the mission president was taking quite a few liberties with the translation and he wryly accused him of it. The mission president faithfully translated that, adding “please don’t laugh,” which brought the house down. Great times.
Minor point- but I think Lynn Packer was Boyd K Packer’s nephew, not brother. Some of my now deceased family members knew Elder Packer quite well and I think he was not pleased with his nephew airing dirty laundry of the brethren. I think Lynn got excommunicated, can’t remember for sure.
As a youth the biggest challenge many of us faced in engaging in the LDS religion was the sheer boredom of it. Probably the same today. Paul Dunn was an exception and he entertained and engaged a generation of youth and made the gospel come alive for us. It was more than a warm fuzzy feeling. We felt like we were an important cog in a wheel that was changing the world. For this alone he deserves some praise and honor.
That PHD turned out to be a liar and con artist was a huge disappointment. But I would rather have one PHD, faults and all, than a dozen of the cautious corporate snoozers we sustain today. A leader can be just as dishonest as PHD using silence and smoke screens and weasel words.
God saved much of a rebellious generation with this deeply flawed man. We need more like him with his positive talents.
Yes Lynn is the nephew. I’ll fix the OP. No Lynn was never exed–in the book he notes that was a rumor started by Dunn’s friends.
JI, the book notes that the apology you posted was not actually written by Dunn, but by the First Presidency.
page 314.