President-elect Trump has promised mass deportations upon taking office in 2025, targeting all illegal immigrants (not just violent criminal types), but also including some who are here lawfully (he has plans to revoke visas for Haitians in Springfield who are here legally) and even including some naturalized US citizens (“denaturalization” is the term you are looking for here). For a sort-of global church like the LDS Church that claims to have warm feelings for immigrants and other marginalized groups, this can raise some tricky issues. Read on.
In the New Testament, Jesus is reported as saying that the two greatest commandments are (1) to love the Lord, and (2) to love your neighbor as yourself (see Mark 12:28-31). That seems like a straightforward directive, but I suspect President Oaks and many MAGA Mormons along with him would see a conflict between these two directives if any “neighbors” (fellow Mormons) happened to be undocumented immigrants. The directive might be reinterpreted as “show your love for God by deporting your neighbor.” Would a member of the Church help deport a fellow Church member by reporting them to ICE? And would the Church encourage or discourage that course of action?
The most recent LDS “official statement on immigration” is from June 10, 2011. You can go read the entire statement. On the one hand, this statement come down firmly on the side of law enforcement (and, presumably, deportation):
Most Americans agree that the federal government of the United States should secure its borders and sharply reduce or eliminate the flow of undocumented immigrants. Unchecked and unregulated, such a flow may destabilize society and ultimately become unsustainable.
As a matter of policy, The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints discourages its members from entering any country without legal documentation, and from deliberately overstaying legal travel visas.
The statement also shows a bit of compassion for immigrants:
The history of mass expulsion or mistreatment of individuals or families is cause for concern especially where race, culture, or religion are involved. This should give pause to any policy that contemplates targeting any one group, particularly if that group comes mostly from one heritage.
While the statement hopes there is a process for those here illegally “to square themselves with the law,” it closes with a commitment to law enforcement:
In furtherance of needed immigration reform in the United States, The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints supports a balanced and civil approach to a challenging problem, fully consistent with its tradition of compassion, its reverence for family, and its commitment to law.
So, summarizing the statement and its various directives, the LDS policy toward illegals in the US is this: (1) you shouldn’t be here illegally; (2) it would be nice if there was a process for you to obtain legal status while you remain here and work; (3) if you are deported, that is consistent with the Church’s “commitment to law”; (4) Church members should be mindful of “the high moral standard of treating each other as children of God”; but (5) nothing is directly stated as to whether members of the Church should assist illegal immigrants, avoid either assisting or reporting them, or go ahead and report them to ICE in line with the Church’s “commitment to law.”
On another page at LDS.org which purports to summarize the current LDS policy on immigration, the following is stated: “We acknowledge that every nation has the right to enforce its laws and secure its borders. All persons subject to a nation’s laws are accountable for their acts in relation to them.” Again, this appears to be a statement in favor of enforcement (and subsequent deportation). Compassion, kindness, blah blah blah, but tough luck: if you get deported, you deserved it.
Let me clarify a couple of issues before moving on to tough questions for readers.
How illegal are illegal immigrants? Some countries offer short-term work visas, possibly renewable, that allows thousands of foreign workers to legally enter the country for work. What the US has is essentially an informal system whereby thousands of foreign workers enter the country *illegally* for work. They are allowed to stay until they get caught, possibly deported, and then possibly return again to do more work.
Who benefits from the informal US foreign worker program? First, the illegal immigrants, who get good paying jobs (compared to what’s available back home) and some of the benefits of living in the US. Second, employers, who can pay illegals less than they would pay fully documents workers. Employers can also threaten illegal employees who bring up pay increases or worker safety issues. Third, consumers like you and I benefit from lower prices for many services and products. Fourth, the US government and local governments, as illegal workers pay lots of taxes, certainly sales taxes for their purchases and often income and payroll taxes, depending on the employer. So pretty much everyone benefits from the informal US approach to importing foreign workers.
The fact that pretty much everyone benefits from the informal US foreign worker program (that is, tolerating lots of illegal immigration) explains why it has been tolerated for so long. If you actually deported ten million illegal immigrant workers from the US, there would be large and negative impacts across the entire economy. It’s not just the price of eggs that would go up. The price of pretty much everything would go up. If you missed Econ 101, that’s the very definition of inflation, a rise in the general price level. Mass deportations will cause inflation.
Is there a moral component to illegal immigration? This is important. Most of us see a distinction between say robbing a bank or selling illegal drugs (these are “morally wrong”) versus going 65 in a 55 or jaywalking (technically these are infractions and no one wants a ticket, but few people feel guilty about speeding or jaywalking). Where does illegal immigration fall?
That’s a serious question. Illegal immigrants are likely to say they are just trying to support their family by finding good paying work across the border. Those who benefit from illegal immigrant workers (recall that’s just about everyone) are likely to look the other way. Even politicians who run for office by campaigning against illegal immigration are only using this to rile up voters and get elected — most of them understand how the system works.
The only people who think illegal immigration is “wrong” in the sense of being morally wrong are a few zealots among the politicians (as opposed to opportunistic politicians who just use the issue to garner votes) and most MAGA voters (including MAGA Mormons) who believe whatever their favorite politicians and their media partners tell them. It’s these MAGA Mormons who might be inclined to report a fellow Mormon (who is an undocumented worker and who attends church on Sunday) to ICE. And then give themselves a pat on the back for showing their love for God by getting their neighbor deported.
So here are a few tough questions for readers. (I’m acknowledging that this is a tough issue all around.)
- Can you make sense of the LDS position on illegal immigration, as reported in the official statements or summaries I have linked to above or elsewhere?
- At the local level, have you heard any bishop or stake president make statements regarding undocumented foreign workers or families in their communities? Were they supporting or discouraging participation in LDS worship services or temple attendance by those known to be undocumented?
- Do you know of any LDS members attending your ward or branch who were illegal immigrants and who were subsequently taken into custody and deported?
- Do you know any LDS members who reported fellow ward members as illegal immigrants or undocumented workers to ICE or other authorities and helped get them deported? Or who possibly bragged about doing so after the fact?
- Remember this: When thousands of Mormons crossed the Plains and arrived in what is now Utah in 1847, it was part of Mexico. They weren’t invited and they didn’t have visas. The “Pioneers of 1847” were illegal immigrants.
Wheat & Tares 
Of course, faithful members will turn in their neighbors. Remember the torture of arrestees suspected of association with 9/11? Many Saints participated, including setting up the systems.
Of course, faithful members will turn in their neighbors. Remember the torture of arrestees suspected of association with 9/11? Many Saints participated, including setting up the systems.
I love the words of Elder Patrick Kearon from the April 2016 General Conference talk “Refuge from the Storm”:
“Being a refugee may be a defining moment in the lives of those who are refugees, but being a refugee does not define them. Like countless thousands before them, this will be a period—we hope a short period—in their lives. Some of them will go on to be Nobel laureates, public servants, physicians, scientists, musicians, artists, religious leaders, and contributors in other fields. Indeed, many of them were these things before they lost everything. This moment does not define them, but our response will help define us.
“Verily I say unto you, Inasmuch as ye have done it unto one of the least of these my brethren, ye have done it unto me.”
It would be good for many people to remember these strong words. Our response to those yearning for a better life truly does define us and reveal what is in our hearts.
Go to any language branch/ward in the US and you will come across illegals. Doesn’t matter if it is a Chinese, Tongan, or Armenian branch/ward. If the Trump Presidency goes through with its deportations its going to destroy a lot of branches and wards.
On my mission, I was told multiple times by members we had dinner with that they wish they could deport all of the Spanish branch in their stake. They didn’t really differentiate between deporting those who are here legally or illegally (frankly it was weird to share those views with 2 random 19 year olds having dinner at your house, but everybody loved telling us missionaries way more than what we needed to know, probably cause we were willing to listen). I don’t doubt there are a lot of members who would relish the chance to deport others of their faith. On the other hand, I get the general sense that most Mormons are more pro immigrant than much of the right is now, so if the Trump Presidency goes big on deporting, its probably going to alienate a lot of Mormons.
Zwingli: I’d love to believe your last sentence, but whenever anyone says “If the Trump Presidency goes big on [terrible thing], it’s probably going to alienate a lot of Mormons,” I’m always surprised by how few Mormons it actually does alienate.
Let us not forget that Tim Ballard (yes, *that* Tim Ballard) spent 10 years as an ICE deportation agent, based in Calexico CA (near the US-Mexico border). There is something deeply morally twisted about a supposedly righteous priesthood-holding man using his mission-acquired Spanish language skills to tell frightened children that they will never see their parents again.
There is indeed something appealing to conservative Mormons about the idea of mass deportation, even though it’s pretty much the opposite of what Jesus taught. There is no version of practical execution of mass deportation that isn’t incredibly racist.
Hawkgrrrl: Sadly you’re probably right, I am just hoping that Church Members will find it disturbing when half of the Spanish Branch in their stake gets deported.
I don’t know what Bible you’re reading, but I’m pretty sure Jesus just meant “Love your neighbors that look like you and were born in the same country as you.” For immigrants, it would be the responsibility of people from their home country to love them.
It’s not like Jesus or his family would ever sneak across a border and live there for a few years to escape persecution, right?
When you think about conference talks and how they rarely talk about anything that happens in the world today and then add to that how talks and lessons in our wards are now regurgitations of conference talks and then consider how any time anyone talks about issues happening in the world today are labeled “political” and how we need to keep church and state separate and then consider the deportation of legal and illegal immigrants because of the action of the government or a president, do we think members of the church would have the moral background and fortitude to say it’s wrong and do something about it? The church is built on obedience. A leader would have to say something for something to get done.
I have decided not to talk about certain politicians (one in particular) who are not eligible to run again. I’m going to focus on issues. Also on politicians that are eligible for reelection.
With that said, I think immigration is a hard issue that touches on every aspect of national policy. It is a moral issue, an economic issue, a national security issue, and a political hot potato.
I think the church position reflects the complexity of the issue. Every nation makes effort to control its borders. The country has an obligation to its citizens to keep threats out, including criminals, terrorists, etc. We have also recognized, at least since WWII, the importance of allowing refugees a place to rehome.
Politicians are exploiting the immigrants for their personal power and agendas. If there are politicians who support an administration that deports millions of hard working immigrants, separating families, without due process, those elected officials should be held responsible for the economic and moral crisis that ensues. And that responsibility might start as soon as the Senate starts confirming ridiculously inappropriate cabinet appointments, or even by adjourning to allow recess appointments. But with that said, I’m not opposed to border control or deportations, when due process is allowed its place.
When all is said and done, I don’t know what the right solution is, but I’d like to see a certain level of control and order that balances humanitarian and security values. It’s not an easy thing to do.
This made me chuckle: “As a matter of policy, The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints discourages its members from entering any country without legal documentation, and from deliberately overstaying legal travel visas.”
Yes, my mission was a couple decades ago. But we all overstayed our legal travel visas by 6-12 months. We got into the country on one-year visas. Sisters overstayed by six months; elders overstayed by 12 months. We missionaries were all illegal immigrants in our mission country. At the airport as we left, someone had the money to pay the fines and off we went.
And about reporting neighbors — the government knows where most of the illegal immigrants are. Neighbors won’t need to report them. As Dave B points out, the illegal immigrant foreign worker status is a longstanding arrangement. Illegal immigrants with jobs get an ITIN (Individual Taxpayer Identification Number) by filing a form with the IRS. They use the ITIN to file tax returns. I’m fuzzy on the details. But a lot of illegal immigrants pay taxes. They don’t get any tax benefits — like you can’t use an ITIN to get social security, or child tax credits, or the earned income credit. Having an ITIN doesn’t make an immigrant legal; it’s just the way they pay taxes if they’ve got a W-2 job.
I was living in Cincinnati when a missionary, returning home after serving an honorable full-time mission, was arrested by ICE at the Cincinnati airport and deported, back in 2009. I didn’t know this missionary, but the missionaries in my ward sure did. At that point the church stopped sending undocumented immigrants to airports because of the risk of deportation.
One of the missionaries I knew in that ward revealed on Facebook, years later, that he had been undocumented too. At the time of his Facebook post he’d been able to get a green card through his wife.
If mass deportation does happen, most of the church’s non-English-speaking wards and branches will be decimated. I hope the church has a plan for protecting these wards and branches.
Adding to Janey’s comment. Church members “of a certain age” recall stories of mission presidents in Central and South American countries slipping money to authoritarian to keep missions open and operating. It seems like it wasn’t even kept secret, just seen as necessary to do the Lord’s work in many countries. And missionaries in so many countries regularly overstay their visas and do so under the direction of church authorities. It does give some of them cognitive dissonance.
We Americans are to blame for this. We have a long-established tradition of winking at laws we don’t really like or want to obey. We use immigrants to harvest our crops, work in hotels and for labor in the construction trades. They game the system because so many American citizens want them to game the system and actively encourage them to do so. Many immigrant workers were driven by desperation. Now the political tides have shifted and the United States may soon embark on deporting 10 million people to countries that may not accept them and for which there is no “home” (housing, social connections, etc.). Some would return at great risk to their lives and family’s safety. Many families would be ripped apart. Mass deportation would be an inherently immoral and unchristian act.
If the Church took a stand on this moral issue, it would face pushback from MAGA members. MAGA has effectively neutered the moral voice of the LDS Church. President Nelson’s accomplishments must come at the approval of the political right. Anything he does which appears “woke” (Like supporting the NAACP) or liberal (like advocating for socially responsible behavior during a pandemic) will be dismissed by MAGA members.
Dave B:
Nary a word about border security, the firehose of fentanyl (and other drugs) flooding across the southern border, the ever growing violence, control and influence of the drug cartels, violence and decay in all of our major cities, the remarkable flow of young men from the middle east and China (let alone everywhere else) illegally crossing the border – and going to “who the hell knows where” and loss of the country’s sovereignty.
But, I suppose I gotta hand it to you….at least you’re consistant; in a myopic sort of way.
(I can picture your office/den at home with dozens of filing cabinets (sort of like the scene at the end of Raiders of the Lost Ark) chock full of progressive/liberal/marxist scripts – which can be pulled out at a moments notice – and then applied as original thought.)
Forget the church’s “policies”, doctrine(s)”, or “statements” and look at its ACTIONS:
The church continues to proudly operate over a dozen immigration “Welcome Centers” near the southwest border and around the nation, assisting migrants to settle in the US. While the church claims that all of their assistance is “only for ‘LEGAL’ migrants”, this is only true in the sense that these illegal migrants have been given the thinly-veiled instant “blessing” by Customs and Border Patrol to stay in the country while still being illegal, in accordance with the current administration’s ridiculous policies that are directly destroying American sovereignty, supporting and encouraging human trafficking, filling our nation with criminals, and the continuing the flow of fentanyl.
Yes, the church is directly ENABLING these crimes, and using members’ tithing donations, and calling “missionaries” to do so. This is reprehensible.
I read grizzerbear55’s comment as satire–acutely aware that it’s offering high rhetorical criticism of right-wing craziness–and it suddenly makes sense! Same with hnorth1’s. A whole new world has opened up. Once I was blind, but now I see.
Brian:
LOL!….what a creative and pithy response!
One of the great satisfactions of my life (particularly this past year) has been to understand – and have the data show – that the uber Left (in no way) represents the vast majority of this country; and, in fact – are the minority. Oh sure, they’re insistently loud, great at chanting slogans, can be horses’s asses (especially in their perceived moral authority) and generally to be found marching for some cause – while everyone else is working and making a positive contribution. (Of course, I recognize that SOMEONE has to work in order to provide the tax base and revenues to throw down the ever growing well of new ravenous social causes).
I think “the public bank” is finally, inexorably running out of cash. So incredibly gratifying.
grizzbear55: “Nary a word about border security, the firehose of fentanyl (and other drugs) flooding across the southern border, the ever growing violence, control and influence of the drug cartels, violence and decay in all of our major cities, the remarkable flow of young men from the middle east and China (let alone everywhere else) illegally crossing the border – and going to “who the hell knows where” and loss of the country’s sovereignty.”
As the kids say, I was today years old when I learned from grizzbear55 that the Sackler family, school shooters, the Las Vegas shooter (deadliest shooting in US history), and the attempted Trump assassins’ are all immigrants!
I wonder, when the immigrants are gone and drugs and violence still continue, who grizzbear55 will blame next? My money is on the LGBTQ community.
Yes I’m calling you out. I’m done letting people say horrible things in my online communities. I’d rather be a horses’ ass than a bigot. YMMV.
Chadwick:
You’ve just proven my point! Most of us have to live in the real World; and yes, it is sometimes tough and cruel. Even Nature is incredibly cruel. I couldn’t possibly care less that “you’re calling me out”. I’m calling you out for being so damn sensitive. What are you so terrified of? That someone doesn’t see the World exactly as you do? Calm down and chill. You’re going to harm yourself.
Claiming people are too sensitive when, in the defense of others, they push back against bullies is . . . a bully move.
But it was always clear that grizzerbear is never interested in dialogue, just a soap box on someone else’s blog. The real danger is that the far-right, with views like grizzer’s, is indeed much, much greater than the far-left. Hate, blame, fear, aggression, it’s all there for the world to see. And they revel in it and call it good.
Grizzerbear, your comments reveal: you are not pithy; you are not gentle or kind; you are not strong; instead, you are scared, fragile, and have an outsized sense of your own supposed rightness and intelligence. In reality, you’re revealing that you’re a small gear in a selfish, mindless machine that cares nothing for you, only it’s own profit.
At least some of us are pushing against it and are living in a real world that see things as they are and not through some childlike candy-story economics, and playground retibution system. But go ahead, convince us that we’re the ones who are lost, throw fits, and complain. I want to belive you have the resources, skills, maturity to do something else. How about come to the grown-up table with some grown-up responses instead of a basket of racist, xenophobis, ignorant, uncharitable platitudes.
There are real facts out there. Immigrants (regardless of how they arrived) are less likely to commit crimes than US -born citizens. You want the world to be more safe? Following your logic, the best thing to do would be to limit US-born citizens, as they commit more crimes than immigrants. I mean, we could have a real conversation, or we could throw pitiful tantrums that everyone else is a commie.
Dave B., to your question about stake presidents and other leaders and their position on immigrants: In my recent Wasatch back stake conference, the visiting authority was a member of the temple presidency and I believe also mission presidency. He was himself an immigrant from South America, probably a legal immigrant. He had two very interesting stories. One was his own story about running out of money at the end of this first semester at BYU and being prompted to go out on the streets to ask for room and board. One LDS family took him in, showed him kindness, offered him room and board and even a job. This experience changed his life and he stayed in the US and has done very well for the church, himself and his family.
He also told the story about a young man that he was soon going to have the privilege of baptizing. The young man had had a harrowing experience over six months walking from Central America through Mexico to the US, scuffling with gangs, police, and border agents. He was obviously an illegal immigrant. This leader related that the young man discovered why he felt he had actually come to America, when he later met the missionaries and wanted to be baptized. The young man was able to bring his childhood sweetheart from their hometown in Central America to the US and this leader was able to perform their civil marriage.
Our stake president had a similarly pro-immigrant message on sharing the gospel with our immigrant neighbors.
These leaders were obviously not concerned about the legal status of these young people and how it affected their spiritual lives. They and the members who helped them were held up as
good examples of for us as Christians to follow.
As a previous commenter said, see what the Church’s actions have been.
The number of people who voted against their interests in this election is astounding. I work with multiple people who will be either directly or indirectly effected by Trump’s immigration “policy(?)” who enthusiasticly voted for Trump over “wokeness.” I have two co-workers from Colombia who were granted asylum who said they would have voted for Trump if they were eligible. Go figure.
In terms of Church response, before the election, our previous stake president was really pushing for Spanish language integration into the wards because they were planning to phase out the Spanish branch. I live in an area where the majority of the population is Latino. Church members interact with these folks everyday and see them as part of the community without really worrying about immigration status.I suppose I could see a couple of hardcore Magas in my ward who might turn in their neighbors, but they would be in the minority. Of course, my particular area doesn’t represent the entire church in the U.S.
My sense right now is that Trump’s plan to deport 10-20 million people( or whatever the number is) is a lot of bluster. It’s one thing to threaten blue states and “sanctuary cities,” but wait until the administration (probably privately) hears from red state Congress people, governors, the agri-business lobby etc. They will continue to tell Joe Schmo Low Info voter what they want to hear, privately, these red state lawmakers know that deporting millions of people would decimate their economies.
Brian:
You have great capacity for monumental self righteousness and supposed superior virtue – as you look down on all of us who work, grovel and fight for our own survival; and yet, somehow, someway…still try to live our lives without our supposed “betters” telling us what to do, what to think and (Heaven forbid) without a dictated……extremely well worn, mostly failed, narrative. It drips off of your lips with such ease…..I’m sure didn’t even have to think before you dictated your comments.
If you desire to declare that Wheat and Tares is nothing more than a Liberal/Leftist Echo Chamber….then, go ahead and do it. But, as you do so, don’t pretend that it’s a forum for all ideas and vigorous discussion. That’s quite disingenuous.
grizzer,
You revel in being part of a billionaire-led majority, while simultaneously claiming a backstory of individualistic survivalism that smacks of social darwinism. Perhaps a little thoughtfulness and introspection derived from the Sermon on the Mount would balance out your inconsistent narrative? “Consider the lilies of the field…”
Thanks for the comments, everyone.
Don’t feed the troll.
grizzerbear55, you can comment on the topic of the post, but stop impugning the character and motives of everyone who you disagree with or who responds to you. I’ve looked up some of your comments elsewhere, and you quite happily join conversations on ex- and anti- posts and forums, so you’re not here at W&T to defend the Church or reprimand commenters for endorsing a progressive view of the LDS Church or even full rejection of it — you seem to agree with that view. It seems the only reason you are here is to somehow “own the libs” at W&T. But this isn’t really a forum for politics. This isn’t really a political site. Yes, on some posts we talk about how politics and other social issues affect the Church and its membership, but comment threads aren’t about rehashing political talking points or discredited conspiracy theories or Hunter Biden’s laptop or Donald Trump’s felony convictions. Give it a try.
Faith Over Fear, yes that Elder Kearon talk is very on point. Thanks for the reminder.
Hawkgrrrl, it’s very hard to alienate a Mormon from any belief once they have slipped into true believer mode. And Mormons are trained from childhood to think in true believer mode.
Rockwell: “With that said, I think immigration is a hard issue that touches on every aspect of national policy. It is a moral issue, an economic issue, a national security issue, and a political hot potato.” I agree. I think that is going to become clear once Trump takes office and tries to implement his mass deportation plan.
Everyone: The logistics and legalities of doing mass deportations are daunting. It’s quite possible he just used that issue on the campaign trail to rile up his followers, and once in office he will pursue other items on his agenda, such as revenge on persons and government departments that tried to hold him accountable for his various transgressions. If he couldn’t build a wall in four years, it is exceedingly unlikely he can execute a much more complicated mass deportation scheme. Now that he’s a lame duck president with no further use for voters, I suspect anything he said while campaigning is of no particular relevance unless it aligns with his personal revenge agenda. I suspect he’ll be happy just to build a few concentration camps, throw a few thousand people in them, then move on to the next shiny object.
Old Man:
One would think that when a person reaches your stage of life – you might have learned to avoid applying this feature in your life….
Sanctimonious: means behaving or speaking in a way that suggests moral superiority to others. It can also mean hypocritically pious or devout.
Dave:
Do you perceive that your counsel to me…..also applies to all who visit W & T? Or, is simply counsel given to those who embrace some some level of Libertarianism and Conservatism?
The reason I ask, is do to a signicant number of posts (especially prior to the election) where Liberal/Progressives could say anything they cared to, impuned others of different beliefs at will…and pretty much “let er fly”.
Hence, the reason I asked Brian “Do you simply wish to declare that W & T is simply a Liberal/Leftist site” and be done with it? This, instead of pretending to be something else.
A few points relevant to this discussion here
1)_A lot of talk about MAGA this, MAGA that, Trump’s policies, etc. But I feel obligated to point out that the democrats are just as complicit in the USA’s barbaric policies towards undocumented immigrants. Remember the 2020 election and all the tears about kids and cages and all that? All of that was true, the US-Mexico border is basically just becoming an open-air concentration camp like Gaza. But none of that went away when Biden won the election and took office. The kids were still in the cages, ICE was still deporting people, companies were still using undocumented child labour. Even the last couple years, and going right up to the election, the democrats’ collective position on immigration and the border is largely the same as the republicans. The democrats have donors that also benefit from having a disposable labour force and they’re (collectively) all for the inhumane immigration policies. The only real difference is that democrats don’t like to talk about it, while republicans like to scream about it.
2) OP is correct in pointing out that the USA overall benefits from undocumented workers. Trump talks up doing mass deportations, there might be some war-crime level demonstrations of this in certain cities and areas of the country. but I doubt it will be enough to make a dent in the overall population of undocumented foreign workers. America runs on slave labour, always has, it just looks different from time to time, and this is why there is a bipartisan consensus on letting it happen but also demonizing the undocumented workers enough to make their removal easy if necessary.
3) On the subject of drug cartels in Mexico. Again, this is something that benefits the USA (not regular people like you and me, but for the good chunk of the capital-owning class). The flippin’ CIA influences/manages the flow of the drugs into the USA and skims off their share for their various off-the-books dark money needs. I know this sounds like tin foil hat stuff, but really, a lot of the most infamous cartel leaders were trained in the USA, by American special forces. Fort Bragg was a big training hub for these guys. Efforts by factions within the Mexican government to take down the cartels get axed due to diplomatic pressure from the USA. The cartels are good for American business. There’s a recent book about this you can read, “The Dope: The Real History of the Mexican Drug Trade” by Benjamin T. Smith.
4) When these kinds of discussions come up among Americans, even liberals sympathetic to the undocumented workers kind of miss the point on why this is happening. Yes there is an acknowledgement of ‘difficult circumstances’ in the home countries of the people who take the risk to go to the USA illegally to get work. But what is unacknowledged is why the circumstances in those other countries are difficult in the first place. The short answer is basically American imperialism. Not only does the USA run on internal slave labour, but it is really dependant upon overseas slave labour. The reason why we have all of these jobs and comparatively higher wages and cheaper consumer goods is because the US government (at the behest of the capital-owning class) enforces unequal equal economic relationships with other countries. Workers overseas are forced to work for slave-wages to produce things like bananas and socks so that Americans can have them for cheap. If some country tries to upset this (like voting in democratically-elected leaders that leaders that promise to raise minimum wages or something and make American companies pay their fair share for the goods) then they face consequences from the USA. Something like 1/3rd of the entire is under varying degrees of US sanctions. Worse case scenario violent coups and regime change.
Here’s the thing, most people don’t want to move to another country with an unfamiliar language and ruling class that will treat them poorly. They would love to stay in their home countries and keep to themselves. But they are COMPELLED by material circumstances to try and find work in the USA as an undocumented worker, compelled by circumstances DELIBERATELY CREATED BY THE USA. We’ve created this cycle on purpose to benefit American capital.
In short, these barbaric and inhumane immigration policies is not just a MAGA/Trump problem, or even just a republican problem. It’s an EMPIRE problem, that democrats are (overall) just as complicit in. If people really wanted illegal immigrants to stop coming the USA (for good or bad reasons) it would mean that the USA has to pull back from its overseas empire and spheres of influence, which means that bananas and socks get more expensive, and at the end of the day, even the most well meaning liberal is going to choose their bottom line over the physical well-being of foreign brown people overseas. This is the reality that they’re unwilling to face, so they’d rather not think about it and just convince themselves that this is a Trump problem.