Last week my wife and I visited our daughter’s family in Eagle Mountain Utah. We were there for our twin granddaughter’s baptisms. I blogged about Engle Mountain in 2017, which you can read here. In that post I talked about how I could see ten LDS Church steeples from my daughter’s back porch. I stood on that same porch last week, and in addition to the ten steeples, I can now see the Saratoga Temple spiral from the porch.
The Saratoga Temple is about a ten minute drive from my daughters house. While we have all wondered what they are doing with so many temples in Utah and Salt Lake County, a new reason came to me while attending church there last Sunday. The kids in my daughter’s ward have a goal to get 2000 baptisms over the summer. My twelve year old grandson goes several times a month, sometimes with just a couple of his friends and one of the mom’s taking them. Same with my grandkids that live in Gilbert Az. During the summer a mom will take a few of the kids to do baptisms on an afternoon.
My daughter told me that during the school year there is a 1-2 month waiting list to get an evening slot for baptisms at the Saratoga Temple. They take walk-ins, but expect to wait over an hour. This appears to be a great way to keep the youth engaged during their teen years. They get used to paying tithing, getting yearly interviews, and pretty much set them on their way for a mission at 18 or 19.
When I was a youth the temple was four hours away (Oakland), so we went once a year, and it was an all day event (Saturday). I maybe did 40-50 baptisms my whole time growing up. My 12 year old grandson has already surpassed that.
Another thing I noticed at the ward last Sunday was all the men with beards. I counted over 15 men with beards, which would be 20% of the total adult male attendance. Two men had full on ZZ Top beards. Now this is not a rural area in Eagle Mountain. The ward is a urban area surrounded by a golf course (call the Ranches for those familiar with the area). My home ward here in California has maybe one or two men with beards.
Is the stigma against beards falling away as we get father and farther away from the 1960’s? Are beards more prevalent in Utah than California?
Do you think the Church will get its return on investment on temple building in more activity, both in adults and youth? Could the youth baptisms be the major goal of all these new temples?
Wheat & Tares 
My brother lives in Eagle Mountain and I am pretty sure no one considers any part of it urban, but rather classic suburban, like pretty much all of Utah now.
I do think that the whole fear of beards as a hippie symbol thing and therefore counter to the ultraconservative sensibilities of church leaders is slowly fading. I am a bit surprised that there would be more beards in Utah wards than in California wards, but maybe the fear of hippies is deeply embedded due to California’s place in the hippie movement. But with JD Vance, who sports a beard, receiving the designation as Sith apprentice, my guess is that members of the MAGA branch of the Mormon movement (or should I say the MAGA root and trunk of the Mormon movement?) will feel the desire to sport more facial hair to show support.
I think you are spot on that one goal of blossoming temples in the desert suburbs of Utah is to give the youth the opportunity to use their “Premium Membership Pass” in a way that ties them deeply to the institution. Who ever came up with the gamification of baptism for the dead for high point leaderboards was a smart marketing person.
So maybe LDS temples are a structure in search of a purpose. Now it sounds like they are filling the void created by the demise of Boy Scouts and the decline of LDS youth activities in general. Kind of strange.
Both counselors in my Southern California ward bishopric have beards. Nobody cares.
Another thing I see in social media is the youth setting goals to perform baptisms at all the temples within driving distance. For I-15 corridor youth, it’s a lot. At our family reunion earlier this month, my sister, brother in law, and niece snuck away one morning to do this in St. George (they live in Lehi).
I imagine this is the purpose of the Rome and Paris temples, to give Mormons with means something to do abroad. It personally blows my mind that one may skip the colosseum for this purpose but peoples is peoples.
Personal opinion, they won’t get the ROI with these Utah temples. Need to look at the macro picture to get an idea of whether or not more temples in places like Utah, Arizona, California, Idaho actually increases the total number of temple visits or not. For example, these youth might be energized about the new temple but that water will rise for a while and then revert to its normal level. I saw that when the Gilbert temple near me opened ten years ago, it was always busy. But it siphoned patrons away from Mesa that was suddenly fairly empty.
if we had data for say a couple of decades on number of temple ordinances performed in all of Utah or Utah County and could assess that against the population and LDS membership data for that same time period, I would not expect it to tell a story of growth.
Thank you Bishop Bill for that report. Here’s what I think is going on with temples:
It’s pretty widely accepted here on W&T and among the thinkers in LDS culture that the “real” reason for full-time missions is to harden the missionary into a lifetime of dedication and service to the Church. There’s this side benefit to others that involves baptism but even if a missionary returns home with just 2 or 3 baptisms in 18-24 months we consider the mission a success as long as the return missionary is active and ready for the next LDS phase in life (marriage, family, callings). It’s funny, we still glorify the stories about conversion baptisms but we know deep down inside that unless your kid is going to Africa those events are rare.
Likewise, there’s an official reason for the temple and then there’s the real reason. The official reason is to gain the saving ordinances for ourselves and for the dead. But the real reason the Church spends all this money on these buildings is to convey growth and to provide members with a real physical reason to stay engaged as Bishop Bill illustrated. We all know that 99% + of the people who have ever lived will not have their temple work done (at least until the theoretical Millenium). So these buildings are pretty inefficient as a saving tool. But they help to keep people in. Just like full time missions.
I guess some people still believe that the purpose of full-time missions is to convert and baptize the world and that the purpose of temple is to provide saving ordinances. But it seems to me that both of these endeavors have turned into pure retention drivers.
I may come across a little more cynical, but it’s pretty obvious that those criticizing all the temples in Utah and Salt Lake counties clearly haven’t attended any of them in a while. I think the reason is far more practical than people realize.
I grew up in southern Utah. We tried to do youth baptisms as a ward at least twice a year. We managed to do 20-60 names a person each visit to the St. George Temple. Fast forward 20 years as a father of five in Lehi, Utah, and we had to schedule weeks to months in advance to get into Mt. Timpanogas with our kids. We were allowed 3-5 names or less at times, depending on how busy they were. I’m admittedly a fast speaker, but it felt like I was barely in the water with my kids before I was thanked and had to leave.
We’re now in the Saratoga Springs district (it will remain our closest temple even when Lehi is built). It takes only slightly less advanced time to schedule baptisms, and the font still stays busy, with only 4-5 names allowed. I don’t see how the youth will meet those baptism goals unless they are taking advantage of multiple temples.
Rumors that the Saratoga Springs Temple is struggling to get temple workers are true. I think it’s less a matter of willingness and more a matter of practicality. This is probably the youngest temple district the church currently has. My wife and I still have all of our children at home but are now one of the older couples in our ward. The priorities of raising children and work understandably take precedence at the moment.
Outside of Utah, I can understand a bit more of the eyebrow raising with increased temple building, but looking at certain metrics, I think they’ll work overall. If not now, certainly in the near future.
I wore a beard faithfully for over eleven years until I was more or less forced to shave it for medical reasons. It was a harder decision than it should have been.
Another perspective on this push for youth baptisms, where are they getting all the names? Let’s admit, after being in the church for generations, all these youths’ family history and temple work is already done. In my own family alone, the first convert into Mormonism was 1831 and the last was 1862. There is no more family history to do in mine and most Mormon families. Every line has already been pushed back to 1500 CE. I know many, many of these names in my own have had their temple work multiple, multiple times. The church has recycled the same names, in my own family tree.
Even if you are a new convert, it does not take too long to have the family list names done. Especially for baptisms, 15-30 for each youth on 1 temple trip. Endowments take a bit longer, but let’s admit the truth, the work is done (especially for baptisms). My wife is an international covert from the 1980’s and surprise there are no more family names. Then the church has these pushes within the wards to do family history. Like the recycled sacrament talk, been there, done that, is there something new? The kids are forced to make up something, or Lie for the Lord, just like we were encouraged to do for mission numbers.
As for doing names outside the church pioneer group, there is the do not do list: Jewish holocaust victims, celebrities, and other unauthorized groups. Despite, written statements by the Q15 the members continue doing these names. Adding to that Bednar had a recent quote “I would invite you to read carefully in the sections in the Doctrine and Covenants that focus on this sacred responsibility. And the language that says that you are to perform these ordinances not for the dead, but for your dead.” So, if our own family history is done, why do we keep going and where are these names coming from? Why does the church push this, and create a false narrative?
Mormon stories #1075-1077 had Don Anderson, a former Family search Sr. VP, noting that the church is not purposefully recycling names. However, some other former family search employees refute his claim. Nevertheless, there has been massive duplication anywhere from 30-80% of ordinances are duplicates. The church then blames the members and not the system they created by stating “as a result of the logistical challenge of vetting names produced by overzealous members and the absolute organizational madness surrounding this whole enterprise.” With polygamy and also with many of the Mormon families tied back to the same 500 families, what else are we to do?
I know within my own family, many, many, many of the names have been duplicated. With more temples and more expectations, they are asking for false data and future cognitive dissonance within the current generation.
Hence, I ask the question, as Bednar states we should be doing our temple work for only own dead, why keep going?
I think the purposes of God for temple work have been accomplished and the great Jehovah can now say “the work is done.” But we know that is not the purpose, just like a mission, the purpose is for the attendee to stay in the church and not for the prospective person.
I don’t live too far from our friend Eli so I am prepping a response if called to be a temple worker – I will no longer be able to hide my PIMO status.
What we really need in Utah is more Dairy Queens and 7-11s.
Our newfound acceptance of beards probably has something to do with us piggybacking a trend among conservatives in general. Behold the beards of Ted Cruz, Eric and Don Jr, Paul Ryan, JD Vance, and Jordan Peterson. We’re late to the party over here but we’ll catch up.
A clean shaven face used to be a rejection of hippie liberalism. But it is femininity, rather than hippie culture, that is the enemy of conservatism in the current culture war. So now the beard is the look-how-straight-and-cis-I-am badge of honor on the right.
Or, if I’m being less cynical, maybe it’s just because shaving is a hassle. I wear a beard simply because I don’t like shaving so maybe that’s why so many others do as well.
what strikes me about tisn photo is that, it is not laid out in squares like traditional by.
Second the roofs are not white, so absorb more heat in summer.
I assume it is a fairly modern development, do they come with water saving devices like low volume/ high pressure showers, dual flush toilets. I see lots of green grass, and no solar panels.
Australia is the driest inhabited continent, and water saving devices are manditory, for when we have droughts. I hear Utah is having a heatwave. I expect they just run the air conditioning 24 hours a day, rather than have efficient houses.
Are there water shortages in Utah and are the citizens asked to help by conserving water. Simple things like turning off the water while cleaning your teeth, having a bucket in the shower to collect the cold water before the hot arrives, and keeping showers as short as possible. The bucket in the shower can water plants or flush toilets. Not watering grass in times of water shortage. Dual flush toilets save incredible amounts of water. Australian invention.
You are an engineer so would appreciate these things.
So the temples are being used by the youth.
Do they have enough staff to man/woman them, and clean them?
We do now have a temple in our city of 2 million but only one ward sized chapel in our stake with 7 units.
Faith,
I’m a multigenerational LDS. My wife had one grandpa who was a convert. My kids continue to find names on both sides, much to my surprise. Still a lot of work to be done.
Chet. Amen to Dairy Queens.
Kirkstall, I had three main reasons for keeping my beard as long as I did. One was that I simply did not like shaving. Another is that I thought I genuinely looked better with it. A third reason that I was not expecting was that I found my wife and I got much better customer service with it. My brother-in-law has experienced the same thing with his beard.
I was never criticized by Church leaders or members for having a beard, but I had an answer ready that I was prepared to deliver deadpan. “Since we’ve been counseled by the brethren to get out of debt as quickly as possible, I’m taking the dollar I save each month from shaving expenses and putting it toward the mortgage.”
Large banks have brick and mortar branches in part because it signals stability and legitimacy. I think LDS temples and in particular increasing number of temples signals the church is growing and strong (even if membership growth is debatable). I’m surprised nobody has modeled cost of temple maintenance over time. I can see a large number of costly temples becoming a giant albatross over time.
I’m sitting in sacrament meeting right now. I count about ten beards including one in the bishopric. I doubt there are more than 50 or 60 people that can grow one. I’ve been supporting mine for nearly 20 years now, basically ever since I escaped church mandates on beards (mission, BYU).
Temple staffing needs to get smarter. Recent changes were probably largely about staffing. (Priests baptizing, anyone witnessing, women at the recommend desk, etc.) Even with all the temples in Utah, they’re really quite busy … during peak hours. The baptistry probably doesn’t need to run most weekdays before 3pm. Maybe a couple during the week. Endowments could run just after 5pm most days.
There is a social aspect to youth baptisms (which I remember rising to the level of slightly suppressed rowdiness when I was a lad) that doesn’t carry over when you go upstairs in the temple. You are around other people, but not “with” other people, the ordinances get longer, and as you get older, you have less free time. So if the intent of building more temples is to lock in the youth early, I’m not sure it’s working.
On beards, I would agree with Kirkstall overall. I think there is sort of a cosplay American frontier rugged individualism going on with a lot of these new beard wearers. You see them driving aggressively on roads provided by the government in their shiny, new trucks with carefully placed Trump and AR-15 stickers, to their comfy office jobs they got in part due to having that nice government subsidized education (yet insist that “woke” college is a waste of time for gen- z). The fact that Mormons have a long history with beards, makes it even cooler, I suppose. I’ve tried growing a beard just for the cold months (I work outside year round), but I can never get past the itchy stage and I shave it off.
Eli, that’s interesting that wearing a beard improved your customer service. My late grandpa (b 1923) was of the opinion that you couldn’t trust men with beards and told me so when I started wearing mine.
I’ve also heard beards described as “makeup for men” and am honestly happy that culturally men are getting more opportunities to express their individuality through them.
BRB gonna go ask Midjourney to show me the Q15 with beards now.
10ac, yes Eagle Mountain is suburban. I was looking for the opposite of rural, and my mind selected urban when suburban was the right choice
Geoff-Aus, it was over 100 F (38 for you) when I was there. Part of Eagle Mountain was under a water restriction for lawns, and they were complaining that the parks and golf courses were still green in the same neighborhood. Las Vegas has mandatory water rules similar to what you have, but I don’t think anyplace in Northern Utah has them. (St. George might in the south). I like the white roof idea!
When I was at BYU 20 years ago, you could always get into an endowment session at the Provo temple. Baptisms were scheduled months out. All of the BYU students who were pre-mission were trying to go do baptisms and the waiting list was long. Initiatories weren’t scheduled, and I quickly learned what times of the day were the best times to go. Initiatories were nice because it was just 30 minutes, but if you went when it was crowded, the wait could be more than hour. They should shorten the endowment to 30 minutes or less. Just the signs, symbols, tokens and done!
When I was a teenager, my friend and I decided to do 20 hours of baptisms for a Personal Progress goal. She had a car and we would go right from high school to do baptisms. We went once or twice a week until we got our 20 hours.
As for beards being like makeup for men — lol! I used to put on lipstick and earrings to go to Home Depot because I got much better customer service. At my local Home Depot, they now have as many women as men helping customers so the makeup is not necessary and I still get my questions answered. :))
I believe that Nephi’s prophecy from 1 Nephi 14 is being fulfilled:
12 And it came to pass that I beheld the church of the Lamb of God, and its numbers were few, because of the wickedness and abominations of the whore who sat upon many waters; nevertheless, I beheld that the church of the Lamb, who were the saints of God, were also upon all the face of the earth; and their dominions upon the face of the earth were small, because of the wickedness of the great whore whom I saw.
13 And it came to pass that I beheld that the great mother of abominations did gather together multitudes upon the face of all the earth, among all the nations of the Gentiles, to fight against the Lamb of God.
14 And it came to pass that I, Nephi, beheld the power of the Lamb of God, that it descended upon the saints of the church of the Lamb, and upon the covenant people of the Lord, who were scattered upon all the face of the earth; and they were armed with righteousness and with the power of God in great glory.
That’s pretty-much how the church looks today. And the “power and great glory” that the saints are armed with is the endowment of power that they receive in the temple. Regular temple worship, in real terms, increases the presence of the Lord in the community of the saints.
The approval of beards for Bishopric members just kind of happened post pandemic. However, I understand temple workers must be shaved.
Does anyone understand why the different standards?
@Geoff-Aus – We live in southern Utah (Washington County) which has basically the same climate as Las Vegas. The Washington County Water Conservancy is really pushing conservation along with other projects such as waste water recycling. I’m quite impressed with how contagious the conservation attitude has been. I’m the president of the HOA for our condo association and we xeriscaped a huge portion of our association. The conservancy announced that we recently replaced 1.5 million square feet of grass and water use per capita has fallen by about 14%. We’ve picked up some good hires from Las Vegas and are also planning some new reservoirs and metering secondary water.
@Janey – I think eventually the church leadership will need to rethink the purpose of the temples. I wish there were a way to just go right to the Celestial room without the presentation and rituals and simply meditate/pray. I also wish there were a way for non-LDS to go to a part of the temple and enjoy serenity and peace. As I’ve mentioned before here, I think temples should be meal preparation sites open for anyone to consume on-site and to ship out ready-to-eat meals to the community for the needy. I’m sure this would be more engaging for the youth (and practical) than a leaderboard for baptisms for the dead.
Jacob L
I really enjoy your vision for the temples. I think serving the homeless and poor from or in the temple would make it more sacred.
<i>”I wish there were a way to just go right to the Celestial room without the presentation and rituals and simply meditate/pray.”</i>
I have done exactly that a couple of times when that was what I needed. Those at the recommend desk have in recent years started asking each time why I am entering the temple, and a year ago in the spring my answer was, “I am going to change into white temple clothes and visit the celestial room.” And then I did that. Another time I went up to the sealing rooms and asked if I could observe a few proxy sealings, and then was allowed to do so until I was ready to leave.
I wish there were a way to just go right to the Celestial room without the presentation and rituals and simply meditate/pray.
There is. Go in, change into whites, go to celestial room. Done. Nothing new there, I have been doing it for nearly 30 years.
Re: beards in the bishopric: the handbook has always been silent on this. It’s nothing but cultural bullcrap.
Look, I wear a beard because I am a rebel and I just like wearing a beard, okay?! Stop normalizing beards for all of the men not man enough to rebel and wear one. I used to to trust LDS men with beards. We were the brotherhood of unorthodox thinkers. Now we have all of these imposters moving in. They are a bunch of shallow Trump-lovin’ chipmunks. Almost makes a guy want to shave again. What is this church coming to?
Kirkstall,
There could be other factors involved. I do think the type of beard matters. I kept mine will trimmed as my beard had a tendency to grow outward instead of downward. Mine was also more of a Captain’s style beard, with the neck clean-shaven to the jaw line. My voice also happens to one of the deepest I’ve ever encountered (James Earl Jones-ish), enough so that it regularly turns the heads of strangers who may be within earshot. It’s entirely possible that with the added beard, I just sort of commanded authority, which I find kind of funny. I’m in no way passive or a pushover, but anyone who takes just a little time to get to know me soon realizes I’m pretty friendly and very easy going. I’ve also been told “you smile with your eyes” and do make an effort to maintain eye contact. But yes, as far as customer service went, the beard made a noticeable difference.
My Dad kept a beard in the nineties the entire five years he was in a bishopric. We were out of town one Stake Conference when a member of the Seventy essentially said no one in leadership should have a beard. Word didn’t get back to my dad until about a month later, when a member walked up to him and said “I sure do admire your rebelliousness.” My dad checked with the Bishop, who simply stated he didn’t have a problem with it, so my Dad kept it until being called to a college ward bishopric years later. Both my dad and my mom felt he looked better bearded.
How dare you mention the majestic Oakland temple and NOT MENTION THE PIES?!?!?!?!
The Oakland cafeteria was a major part of the visit and not getting pie was not an option.
As a PIMO who isn’t a fan of the temple anymore, I’ll defend Oakland and the pies until the day I die.
(Sad note, I’ve been told they don’t offer pie anymore)
In other news, the Fresno temple would have fit in perfectly to the Fairview TX zoning laws.
Jacob L, The standard American toilet uses 7 gallons (28l) per flush. Caromas dual flush toilets use 3litres for a small flush and 5 for a big one.
You could save 30 gallons per person per day, by changing the toilets to dual flush.
Geoff,
I’m not sure why Google shows the 7 gallon flush as a search result. The “standard” flush of an American toilet is regulated by federal, state and local government and the gallons of water has been greatly reduced since 1993.
Since 1993, the federal government limits American toilets to have a maximum of 1.6 gallons per flush. Many local governments have a lower limit.
I’m amused that having to schedule a youth trip 1-2 months out seems burdensome. Our temple is three hours (nearly 200 miles) from our chapel, and it’s typical to announce trips months ahead of time. Our youth still go 3-4 times a year, which seems like a lot. We’re in the United States.
20 years ago in Provo I was able to easily pop into the baptistry. Perhaps group scheduling was held to certain slots and was more difficult?
I’m a fan of beards. A friend of mine was a bearded bishop but shaved to take a BYU job. He looked much better bearded.
Like so much of what you post in the bloggernacle about the USA, this is just plain false.